22:51 < kiwhen> There are a couple of things that I might have misunderstood. The varints for example.
22:52 < kiwhen> I've formatted them as 4 bytes with the msb set for the first three, and the groups in reversed order.
22:53 < kiwhen> So when I'm sending 9, I go like 0x80 0x89 0x80 0x00.
22:57 < Jckf> o/
22:58 < kiwhen> \o
22:59 < Jckf> This may or may not work https://github.com/Jckf/PHP-Minecraft-Query
22:59 < Jckf> Never got around to finishing it, but maybe it helps you somehow
23:00 < Jckf> The repo I forked it from is still active though. Have a look
23:02 < Jckf> Also, why do you set $port's default value to 0, then check for a false value to set it to 25565?
23:02 < Jckf> Just set it to 25565 to begin with
23:03 < kiwhen> Good point.
23:04 < kiwhen> I think there used to be a reason for it, something along the lines of printing a warning when no port was assigned.
23:04 < kiwhen> Like "assuming 25565". It wouldn't be able to tell the difference if it was already set to 25565.
23:09 < Grum> that is one creative implementation of the protocol hehe
23:12 < kiwhen> Ah, got it working now!
23:12 < kiwhen> It was the varints, they were supposed to be written in as 1 byte, not 4.
23:35 < angal`> Why there are a packet, which sends player abilities to server?
--- Day changed jeu. sept. 18 2014
00:23 < nickelpro> kiwhen: They're supposed to be written as a variable number of bytes depending on the value, thus "VARint"
00:31 <+SpaceManiac> angal: the client uses it to tell when they are flying or not; the rest of the values are ignored
17:32 < TimVosch15> Hey mbcx2 if you're online could you change the 'MCaap' server to the following: 'yarss' https://github.com/TimVosch/yarss ? (I changed a few things to make it look better :) )
17:33 < TimVosch15> Nevermind I messed it up I'll send you a PM on the forums later.
19:29 < morfin> hello
19:30 < morfin> does i properly understanded: some block X(one of 48 in chunk) can update but in case of wheat, trees etc i should also check some random to check if that should happen?
19:31 < morfin> *did i properly understand
19:34 < Grum> dx: yes i did that once ... eons ago
19:35 < dx> Grum: i don't believe you, i bet you've been the past 25 hours 30 minutes trying to beat it so you could answer yes
19:37 < dx> i mean that was a suspiciously long time to answer
19:38 < Grum> oh i just didnt see it until now :)
19:40 < dx> seems legit
19:42 < cindy_k> lol
19:52 < Turingi> what will the microsoft acquisition mean to 3rd party and mod developers?
19:52 < redstonehelper> they are going to jail you
19:53 < TkTech> Turingi: No one knows. Ask again in a month.
20:20 < MazenMC> Hey, I've been recently trying to work with the Minecraft Login protocol and specifically creating sessions. As of now when I try to /hasJoined I get a Http response 204, if somebody could help me that would be great. Source: https://github.com/TridentSDK/Trident/blob/master/src/main/java/net/tridentsdk/packets/login/PacketLoginInEncryptionResponse.java#L145-L162
21:00 < TimVosch15> Fragmer: If you got any spare time. I'd like to know how I can convert a compound to a buffer. Because I don't need a root tag for Slot Data enchantment: http://wiki.vg/Slot_Data
21:01 <+SirCmpwn> if anyone is interested in the inferno debage
21:01 <+SirCmpwn> debate*
21:02 <+SirCmpwn> github followed through with my DMCA notice and the inferno "team" took down their github org. Word on the street is that they're setting up a self hosted repository
21:03 < TimVosch15> +SirCmpwn: What's inferno? :S
21:03 <+SirCmpwn> a post-bukkit attempt at a server
21:03 < TimVosch15> Ahh ok, thanks.
21:03 <+SirCmpwn> that originally forked C#raft, then dumped Craft.Net into their repo and removed my license (DMCA notice), then switched back to C#raft
21:04 <+SirCmpwn> I wouldn't have sent a DMCA notice under normal circumstances, but when I confronted them in a friendlier manner they were assholes about it
21:33 < TimVosch15> +fragmer: I already asked this but you might have missed it. How can I get the buffer from a compound without the root tag.? Take a look at this: http://pastebin.com/nstbksb6
21:34 < TimVosch15> +fragmer: And I cant .toString() a nbtCompound to get the need format. I have to break and hover over it :P 
21:34 < TimVosch15> neat*
22:14 < TimVosch15> +fragmer: After some debuggin I noticed the client ignores the root tag :P So the error wasn't in the root compound. 
22:44 < redstonehelper> SirCmpwn: you have a link to their dmca'd repo?
22:44 <+SirCmpwn> no, they deleted their github org
22:44 < redstonehelper> aw
22:44 <+SirCmpwn> https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2014-09-17-CraftdotNet.md
23:35 < Drainedsoul> lol DMCA notices
23:53 < TimVosch15> Hey, mbcx2. I couldn't PM you so I replied to the thread. Could you read that. I'm off for tonight!
--- Day changed ven. sept. 19 2014
00:10 < Dhruv0> Question
00:10 < Dhruv0> For BlockChange, does the client return the BlockId encoded like the server sent it?
00:11 < Dhruv0> meaning (BlockType << 4) | (BlockType & 0xf) like that
05:19 < Not-fc45> [Glowstone] SpaceManiac pushed 3 commits [+2/-0/±8] http://git.io/--ih0A
05:19 < Not-fc45> [Glowstone] SpaceManiac 64345cd - Added basic potion effect definitions (fixes #295).
05:20 < Not-fc45> [Glowstone] SpaceManiac deleted branch blockevents
06:38 < Grum> SirCmpwn: why would you send a DMCA if you have a permissive license?
06:39 <+SpaceManiac> as I understand, the violated the one provision of MIT, which is "include this license file"
06:40 <+SirCmpwn> Grum: SpaceManiac is correct, MIT requires you to include the license file and copyright notice
06:40 < Grum> I guess they also refused to add it within a reasonable amount of time after it was requested they added it?
06:40 <+SirCmpwn> no, they refused to add it at all
06:40 <+SirCmpwn> I joined their IRC channel to ask them to fix the issue, but they were assholes about it
06:40 < Grum> then fuck them :)
06:40 <+SirCmpwn> indeed
06:41 < Grum> and the license doesn't even specify you need to allot time to 'cure' an ailment
06:43 < Grum> unlike some other licenses on repositories certain other people dmcad
06:52 < dx> they also didn't admit they copied and rebranded the craft.net code, just kept saying "the dmca is invalid" and sent a pull request to the github dmca repo removing the file, lol
06:52 < dx> it wouldn't be too hard for them to do things right. they just don't want to
07:05 <+AndrewPH> insider info says they're very aware that the dmca request was valid, so methinks they could be hunting for some trouble
07:06 < dx> i wouldn't say hunting for trouble intentionally, they are just being stupid about it
07:07 <+AndrewPH> I don't mean they're literally trying to get in trouble
07:07 <+AndrewPH> I mean they could be in for quite a bit of hurt
07:08 < dx> oh derp ok
07:10 < Grum> not really hurt, just a chase
07:10 < Grum> they can at any moment stop it by putting in the license
07:11 < dx> sure
07:12 < dx> but meanwhile, be sure to keep enough popcorn around
07:13 <+AndrewPH> isn't knowingly disputing a valid dmca takedown request slightly illegal? or is it just immoral
07:14 < dx> not sure what "slightly illegal" means
07:15 <+AndrewPH> .. illegal.
07:15 < dx> heh
07:15 < dx> i mean it was a copyright infringement already
07:16 < dx> all that changes is that they are aware of it and keep doing it. i guess the question should be: does that make it worse? who knows.
07:16 < dx> and they didn't send a counter notice, that would be something different
07:16 <+AndrewPH> yeah counter notices (which I'm guessing they didn't send anyway) need to be true under penalty of perjury (slight paraphrasing)
07:17 < dx> https://github.com/github/dmca/pull/49 they just sent this, which is just lame
07:18 <+AndrewPH> ah yes
07:18 <+AndrewPH> what a counter-notice that is
07:21 < Grum> AndrewPH: it's actually worse, point 4 of githubs counternotice crap is the reason i'm not putting my hand in the fire to wipe the CraftBukkit's one :/
07:22 < dx> this? https://help.github.com/articles/dmca-takedown-policy#b-counter-notification-policy
07:22 < Grum> yeah
07:24 <+AndrewPH> Could you elaborate? IANAL and can't figure out what exactly it means
07:25 < dx> "Service of process is the procedure by which a party to a lawsuit gives an appropriate notice of initial legal action to another party, court, or administrative body in an effort to exercise jurisdiction over that person so as to enable that person to respond to the proceeding before the court, body, or other tribunal"
07:25 < dx> so many words
07:25 < dx> so i guess this means a lawsuit goes next?
07:26 < Grum> from how i understand it, agree to get sued in California US
07:26 < Grum> which as someone from non-US is absolutely madness
07:31 < dx> Grum: even if sending a counter notice was 'free', what would you send it for, in the case of craftbukkit? it seemed to me that there's no way to dispute that, other than, well, burying it even more by claiming the GPL code infringes mojang's copyright :P
07:31 < Grum> the dmca is invalid
07:32 < Grum> you cannot dmca a (l)gpl repo for using another gpl repo o.O
07:32 < Grum> that is not how it works :)
07:32 < Grum> by itself in the repository there is nothing that violates the 'gpl' of Bukkit
07:32 < dx> ah i see, so it's debatable in that sense. he's arguing that the NMS code isn't lgpl
07:33 < enchilado> So Wesley Wolfe was just upset because he thought he should have been paid to work on free software, right?
07:33 < dx> enchilado: irrelevant
07:33 < Grum> enchilado: no comment
07:33 < Grum> dx: no its very relevant actually
07:33 < dx> Grum: yes but it's not a good reason to send a DMCA
07:33 < enchilado> I don't see how it's irrelevant
07:33 < Grum> dx: indeed
07:33 < Grum> it just explains the reason why
07:34 < dx> yeah, what motivated him, maybe
07:34 < enchilado> People can do things without them being good reasons
07:34 < enchilado> without them having, rather
07:34 < dx> also, remember that's just speculation unless you can quote him saying he did it for that reason
07:34 < Grum> anyhow, in itself CB doesn't violate GPL, *perhaps* the end product of it does
07:35 < enchilado> Well, I didn't say that was why, I just asked
07:35 < Grum> dx: which is why i said no comment =)
07:35 < dx> just needed to make that clear
07:35 < Grum> i could do that as well, i do not think it is nice to do however
07:36 < Grum> anyhow, neither me nor Dinner want to put hands in the legal fire started by someone with a grudge and little sanity
07:37 < dx> :(
07:37 < Grum> that said, doesn't mean no-one will
07:37 < Grum> you might have noticed we're a bit pre-occupied sofar
07:38 < dx> yeah i heard you were adding landmines to minecraft
07:38 < dx> very excited for that feature
07:38 <+AndrewPH> the fuck, add camels god damn
07:38 <+AndrewPH> I've been waiting for 3 years for camels
07:38 < dx> perl plugin api?
07:38 <+AndrewPH> that too
07:38 <+AndrewPH> rewrite minecraft in php it's faster
07:38 < dx> hell yeah
07:39 < dx> thank you Grum, really looking forward for minecraft 1.9
07:39 < Grum> with camels?
07:39 < dx> yes
07:39 < Grum> we already use CamelCase classes!
07:39 < Grum> and there are plenty of landmines in the code
07:39 < dx> that's a very disappointing kind of camel
08:48 < Not-fc45> [Glowstone] SpaceManiac pushed 1 commit [+1/-0/±23] http://git.io/GTK2wQ
08:48 < Not-fc45> [Glowstone] SpaceManiac 65b67c1 - Added checkstyle and fixed code to obey it (thanks @megawatts).
10:59 < bgale> man how can you fail to use MIT-licensed software properly
10:59 < bgale> that's so trivial...
11:03 < zml> haha https://github.com/github/dmca/pull/47/files
11:04 < MrARM> lol
11:08 < shoghicp> https://github.com/github/dmca/pull/49
11:26 < dx> kangarko changed the title from How come this stupid 1984 became 2014??!? to How come 1984 became 2014??!? What comes next? And after next? 12 days ago
11:29 < dx> "I am going to shit my pants off"
11:30 < dx> guy who submitted this PR confirmed to be 12
11:30 < dx> or maybe less..
11:30 < bgale> dae gpl is literally 1984
11:32 < zml> the real humor is in the closed PR's :)
13:04 < Aragas> so, now we can only use for debuggin' vanilla servers, yes?
13:05 < shoghicp> use what?
13:05 < Aragas> servers
13:06 < shoghicp> use servers for servers?
13:06 < Aragas> ah, nope
13:07 < Aragas> eg debug clients
13:07 < shoghicp> why would that be?
13:07 < shoghicp> is there something that I missed?
13:08 < Aragas> spigot use not so much memory
13:08 < Aragas> dmca, ou know
13:08 < shoghicp> I feel like I need more context
13:08 < Aragas> sec
13:08 < shoghicp> you mean spigot can only be used to debug things?
13:08 < Aragas> https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2014-09-05-CraftBukkit.md
13:09 < shoghicp> yes, I know about it
13:09 < Aragas> it cannot be used more, i mean, legally. For now
13:09 < shoghicp> they are releasing binary patches now
13:09 < Aragas> oh, nice
13:09 < shoghicp> it can be used, but they can't host the original build
13:10 < shoghicp> so they provide a build number and a md5 hash
13:10 < Aragas> yep
13:10 < shoghicp> http://www.spigotmc.org/threads/spigot-update-20140909a.29091/
13:11 < Aragas> thx
19:17 < Jckf> Which packet does the client send to break a block? I haven't been up to date on the protocol since beta 1.7, and it seems to have changed =P
19:27 < Jckf> 0x07
20:28 < expir3dcow|away> j
20:29 < dx> k
22:13 < Dhruv0> Is this correct for BlockChange? stream.WriteVarInt((BlockType << 4) | (BlockType & 0xf));
22:14 < shoghicp> Dhruv0: double BlockType?
22:14 < shoghicp> shouldn't it be BlockType and BlockData?
22:15 < Dhruv0> shoghicp: What would BlockData be?
22:16 < shoghicp> blockId and BlockData
22:16 < shoghicp> for example... wool colors
22:19 < Dhruv0> Oh
22:37 < Dhruv0> shoghicp: How is BlockData sent now?
22:39 < shoghicp> <shoghicp> shouldn't it be BlockType and BlockData?
22:39 < shoghicp> stream.WriteVarInt((BlockType << 4) | (BlockData & 0xf));
22:42 < Dhruv0> shoghicp: how is BlockData sent though?
22:42 < Dhruv0> I need to store BlockData before I encode it
22:42 < shoghicp> it's a number :P
22:42 < shoghicp> in blocks, 4 bits
22:44 < Dhruv0> XD, "It's a number :P" bit obvious
22:44 < Dhruv0> Ok, 4 bits
22:44 < Dhruv0> k try 1
22:44 < Dhruv0> BlockType = BlockType >> 4 & (BlockType | 0xf);
22:45 < shoghicp> why are you doing that...
22:45 < shoghicp> stream.WriteVarInt((BlockType << 4) | (BlockData & 0xf));
22:45 < shoghicp> you already got it
22:45 < Dhruv0> No no, I'm trying to read the packet
22:45 < shoghicp> aha
22:45 < Dhruv0> I got writing down, I think
22:45 < shoghicp> BlockType = varInt >> 4;
22:45 < Dhruv0> (Also, I'm trying to read the packet because BlockData doesn't exist
22:45 < shoghicp> BlockData = varInt & 0xf;
22:46 < Dhruv0> Ty
--- Day changed sam. sept. 20 2014
00:46 <+SirCmpwn> so this Inferno guy moved to self hosted git instead of cooperating with the law
00:46 <+SirCmpwn> so I looked him up, turns out he's a 14 year-old in florida
00:47 <+SirCmpwn> just got off the phone with his parents, problem seems to be resolved now :)
00:47 < humerusj> What was the issue?
00:48 <+SirCmpwn> someone copied Craft.Net into their codebase whole, removed the license, and rebranded it
00:48 <+SirCmpwn> so I got in touch with them to ask them to fix it and they were not friendly
00:48 <+SirCmpwn> so I sent github a DMCA notice and then my story from a few moments ago begins
00:49 < humerusj> Wow
00:49 < humerusj> And it was a 14 yr old that didn't comply...
00:50 <+SirCmpwn> it's happened before, it usually ends with "hey, you're violating the terms of my license, can you please put it back"
00:51 <+SirCmpwn> and then they do so
00:51 <+SirCmpwn> but this kid decided to be an asshole instead
00:54 <+AndrewPH> haha
00:54 < TimVosch15> Haha nice solution xD!
00:54 <+AndrewPH> his age explains a lot
00:54 <+AndrewPH> mostly why he would disregard a dmca takedown request
00:56 < Dhruv0> Lol
01:04 < enchilado> The law? What is that? I'm on the Internet
01:13 <+AndrewPH> I'm literally untouchable! I'm 14 and on the internet! LAWS?!?!?
01:14 < enchilado> I own the site, so how would they ban me?
01:24 < benbaptist_> LOL
01:25 < benbaptist_> that's crazy. though I've met far more intelligent 14/15/16/etc year olds on the internet before, so I couldn't jump to say that it's his age. but that is still pretty stupid.
01:29 < barneygale> SirCmpwn: hahahaha that's amazing
01:58 < Drainedsoul> wow that was pathetic
01:59 < Drainedsoul> I tracked some 14yo down because he "stole" my bits
02:00 < enchilado> "bits"?
02:00 < Drainedsoul> yes you know, 0 and 1
02:00 < Drainedsoul> this outrageous lawbreaker of a 14 year old stole SirCmpwn's bits, even though SirCmpwn still has them
02:01 <+AndrewPH> as you can see, sircmpwn sued him for tens of thousan- oh wait
02:01 < Drainedsoul> which means what?
02:01 < barneygale> yah it wasn't the first thing he did
02:01 <+SirCmpwn> on second thought, I shouldn't get credit for 3 years of hard work and tens of thousands of lines of code
02:01 <+SirCmpwn> good point
02:01 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: it means shush, this is hardly radical. 
02:02 < barneygale> SirCmpwn: you asked him first, right?
02:02 <+SirCmpwn> yep
02:02 <+AndrewPH> yea, and he was met with hostility
02:02 < barneygale> right
02:02 < barneygale> and then dmca'd, so he took it off site
02:02 < barneygale> and it's a bloody MIT license
02:02 < barneygale> come on
02:02 <+SirCmpwn> also, didn't know he was 14 until I started looking for him, and was nice enough to call his parents instead of my lawyer
02:02 <+AndrewPH> literally the hardest license to break except for the do-whatever-you-want license
02:02 < enchilado> Isn't it do-what-the-fuck-you-want?
02:03 <+AndrewPH> yeah I can never remember the proper wording
02:03 <+SirCmpwn> WTFPL
02:03 < Drainedsoul> SirCmpwn: So you built Craft.NET for "credit"?
02:03 <+AndrewPH> No, that's a side effect of doing something popular.
02:03 <+SirCmpwn> well, for one
02:04 < Drainedsoul> Oh so it's popular?
02:04 <+SirCmpwn> I give it away for free
02:04 <+SirCmpwn> the only thing I have to gain from it is credit
02:04 <+SirCmpwn> I did it for fun but it is *my* work, and hard work at that
02:04 < Drainedsoul> If it's popular, what's the risk?  He's already "get[ting] credit"?
02:04 <+AndrewPH> why are you confronting him about doing the legal and moral right thing?
02:04 <+SirCmpwn> not if you steal it, rebrand it, and throw it into your codebase without my license or copyright statement
02:04 < barneygale> yeah :/
02:04 < Drainedsoul> what does the "legal [...] right thing" have to do with anything?
02:04 <+AndrewPH> if that kid goes through life thinking he can get away with this, it'll just lead to bigger issues
02:04 <+AndrewPH> legally and morally it would be wrong not to stop him.
02:04 < Drainedsoul> are you saying that things that are legal are right?
02:04 < barneygale> it's licensed under MIT because SirCmpwn wants credit. Why is that such a ridiculous thing to ask?
02:05 <+AndrewPH> no you moron
02:05 < barneygale> that's pretty normal imo
02:05 < barneygale> like, are you suggesting people should work on all projects anonymously?
02:05 <+SirCmpwn> he is saying that my actions are both legally and morally just, not that those things depend on each other
02:05 <+SirCmpwn> right?
02:05 <+AndrewPH> correct
02:05 < Drainedsoul> It being legally just has nothing to do with anything.  There are many things that are or were legally just that I wouldn't advocate.
02:06 < Drainedsoul> and the fact that what's "legally just" can change should be sufficient for people not to hold it up as some kind of standard
02:06 < barneygale> hence him saying "and morally"
02:06 < barneygale> :/
02:06 < Drainedsoul> it is -- by its own implicit admission -- an inaccurate view of "just"
02:06 <+SirCmpwn> you don't understand.
02:06 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: it sounds like you just want to hate sircmpwn
02:06 <+SirCmpwn> it is morally just for me to follow up on this
02:06 <+SirCmpwn> and I have the support of the law in doing so
02:06 <+SirCmpwn> there are things that are morally right but not supported by law, which is different
02:06 < Drainedsoul> So if I were to build a fence, and my neighbour were to copy that fence, I would be morally just in demanding he tear it down?
02:07 <+AndrewPH> only if you trademarked that fence m8
02:07 < barneygale> do you know what copyright is
02:07 <+SirCmpwn> you write a book
02:07 < barneygale> you might be able to patent a fence design..
02:07 <+SirCmpwn> it takes you three years to write this 40,000 word book
02:07 <+SirCmpwn> and you give it away for free! You even let people modify it and use it as the basis for more books
02:07 <+AndrewPH> barneygale: in which case he would be in the clear for demands :)
02:07 <+SirCmpwn> provided that they credit you as the author
02:07 <+SirCmpwn> but someone takes your book, changes the title, and puts their name on the cover instead of yours
02:08 <+SirCmpwn> thus, there is a problem.
02:08 < barneygale> ^
02:08 < Drainedsoul> I've written a book.  It was 168010 words, and didn't take no 3 years.
02:08 <+AndrewPH> have you tried crying about it Drainedsoul 
02:08 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: That's a useful contribution to the discussion, thank-you. /s
02:08 <+AndrewPH> no problem m8
02:08 <+AndrewPH> So is everything you've said /s
02:09 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: That's not very compelling.
02:09 <+AndrewPH> That's a shame.
02:09 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: so you've complained about stuff. What do you suggest? No copyright at all, or just cut down?
02:09 < enchilado> Copyright is the work of Satan
02:10 < enchilado> We should be free to use whatever software we want for free
02:10 <+AndrewPH> crediting people sure sucks. Nobody should get any credit for anything
02:10 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: That's a misrepresentation.
02:10 <+SirCmpwn> free to use and profit from other people's work, giving no credit or code or anyhting back to the original author?
02:10 < enchilado> I always pirate software because I don't think that programming is very difficult and the people that made it don't deserve to be paid
02:10 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: yeah?
02:10 <+SirCmpwn> the kid was asking for (and receiving!) donations
02:11 < barneygale> I mean, that's an OK position to hold. But if you *actually want that to happen*, attacking developers for releasing their code for releasing their code as open-source rather than public domain is surely an unpersuasive line of reasoning
02:11 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: That's not what I'm attacking him for.
02:11 < barneygale> Then what?
02:11 < Drainedsoul> I'm attacking him for hunting this person down and harassing him.
02:11 < enchilado> ......................................
02:11 < barneygale> What's the point in an open source license if it's not enforced? It's not like MIT is difficult to comply with
02:12 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: That's standard legal procedure m8.
02:12 < enchilado> He wasn't harassing him, you idiot
02:12 < enchilado> He was simply getting him to stop
02:12 <+SirCmpwn> would you prefer that he opened a summons in the mail?
02:12 <+AndrewPH> Contacting the person in question, or in this case his guardians, and requesting firmly to stop.
02:12 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: bear in mind he'd already contacted him online, then DMCA'd
02:12 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: And?
02:13 < enchilado> Bear in mind that Drainedsoul is spouting pure shit
02:13 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: If I did something, someone contacted me, and then started calling my family about it, I'd consider that harassment.
02:13 < Drainedsoul> enchilado: Citation needed.
02:13 < enchilado> Not really
02:13 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: citation granted: #mcdevs
02:13 <+SirCmpwn> <Drainedsoul> pure shit
02:13 < barneygale> So? The guy was ignoring him while committing a crime. SirCmpwn could take him to court. What's wrong with calling him?
02:13 < enchilado> Drainedsoul is probably actually the guy that did it
02:13 <+SirCmpwn> I didn't even try that hard, I just googled his name and found him in a phonebook
02:13 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: Sure.  But the backing to your argument there is the law.  Which is by its own admission fallible since it changes.  So what makes this law a good law, but not other laws that do or have existed?
02:14 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: what?
02:14 < enchilado> Yeah I wish the police would stop harassing murderers, don't you?
02:14 < barneygale> I'm not debating the moral legitimacy of the law
02:14 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul is not that smart.
02:14 < Drainedsoul> enchilado: That's a red herring.
02:14 <+AndrewPH> reading over some of his reddit comments, it's apparant that he's quite possibly an astrology major.
02:14 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: So you're saying that all laws are good laws and that they should all be enforced all the time?
02:14 < barneygale> I'm not debating the moral legitimacy of the law
02:14 < barneygale> Again
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> ...a law is a law
02:15 < barneygale> (which implies I think not all laws are just)
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> they should all be enforced
02:15 < enchilado> AndrewPH: there are univerities that teach astrology?
02:15 < Drainedsoul> SirCmpwn: Congratulations, you've learned to construct tautologies.
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> if you disagree with the law, take it to court and have it overturned
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> there is a procedure for these things
02:15 <+AndrewPH> enchilado: maybe! if there are, he's definitely there.
02:15 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: you've managed to talk like a young'un trying to sound smart :P
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> it is not a maybe-law
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> it is a law
02:15 <+SirCmpwn> law-if-the-cops-are-feeling-up-to-it
02:16 < Drainedsoul> SirCmpwin: Well at least that position is consistent, if one I find morally intolerable.
02:16 < Drainedsoul> *SirCmpwn
02:16 < enchilado> You can start typing someone's nick and then press TAB to complete it automatically
02:17 < Drainedsoul> enchilado: In a lot of cases it's faster for me to type the nick, rather than type, TAB, check to make sure it's the right one, delete the "," my IRC adds thereafter, and continue.
02:18 < Drainedsoul> s/IRC/IRC client/
02:18 < enchilado> Use a client that inserts a colon rather than a comma, then
02:18 < enchilado> And why wouldn't it be the right one? My client completes to the most recent matching nick
02:18 < Drainedsoul> It probably is the right one.  I'm not in the habit of blithely accepting autocompletions/-corrections however
02:19 < enchilado> Yes I suppose it is rather blithe of me
02:19 < enchilado> I hope you don't find that morally intolerable
02:20 <+AndrewPH> enchilado: That's a misrepresentation. Also, that's a red herring.
02:21 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: Are you capable of usefully contributing or not so much?
02:21 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: I think you should rather be asking yourself that question, based on what I've seen tonight
02:22 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: after the repo was moved off github to avoid the DMCA, what should SirCmpwn have done?
02:23 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: Maybe if you articulated yourself clearly and usefully I would see your point-of-view and do so.
02:23 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: As far as I'm concerned he never should've sent the DMCA takedown in the first place.
02:23 < barneygale> why not?
02:24 <+AndrewPH> What's wrong with enforcing the DMCA when it's apparant that they are going out of their way to break it?
02:24 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: Because I don't think people have the moral authority to control what people do a certain pattern of bits.
02:24 <+SirCmpwn> is there anything that an individual can do and then dictate how it's used?
02:25 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: ergo no copyright?
02:25 <+AndrewPH> I guess, then, people shouldn't be stopped in Minecraft when they're "griefing"
02:25 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: As copyright is currently understood, yes.
02:25 <+SirCmpwn> if I make a painting and someone takes a picture of it and starts selling copies of it
02:25 <+AndrewPH> the moderators of those servers should just let it happen, since it's just a bunch of bits.
02:25 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: That's different.  The server owner has control over a physical, excludable resource -- the server.
02:25 <+SirCmpwn> is that acceptable?
02:25 < barneygale> Drainedsoul: why, then, complain about an MIT project? Compared with commercial software, SirCmpwn is 99% of the way toward what you're suggesting
02:26 < barneygale> Why act like a dick to your closest allies?
02:26 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: I'm not complaining about the project.
02:26 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: Ah, so you're saying disallowing somebody to edit some bits is morally reprehensible, while disallowing somebody to edit some bits is perfectly okay?
02:26 < barneygale> But you are if you're suggesting software licenses shouldn't exist.
02:26 <+SirCmpwn> I can't seem to find your github account, Drainedsoul
02:26 < Drainedsoul> AndrewPH: I'm not saying anything about editing bits.
02:26 <+SirCmpwn> at least assuming that you aren't that one dude with only one repo
02:27 < Drainedsoul> SirCmpwn: https://github.com/RobertLeahy
02:27 <+SirCmpwn> well, to be frank
02:28 <+SirCmpwn> there's nothing interesting here
02:28 < Drainedsoul> barneygale: At least as "software licenses" are currently understood, yes
02:28 <+SirCmpwn> do you really have a right to speak on these matters?
02:28 <+SirCmpwn> you and your 4 users, that is
02:28 < Drainedsoul> SirCmpwn: Lol.  Watch out, SirCmpwn is hating on my Github cred.
02:29 < Drainedsoul> Anyway, I'd love to stay and chat, but there's fine wine downstairs, adios
02:29 <+SirCmpwn> no, I'm wondering if you even know what it's like to manage a large scale, popular project
02:30 <+AndrewPH> Drainedsoul: btw "intent to xyz" is an arrestable offence, looking at a similar argument you've had recently
02:30 <+AndrewPH> (and, of course, now I see how all the hot air is being kept when you're not blowing it out)
02:31 < enchilado> I don't understand how anyone could be morally opposed to software copyright. Is it so they don't feel bad about pirating things?
02:35 < Jckf> I'm sorry to interupt you guys, but I've been digging around the vanilla 1.7.10 server all day without finding what I'm looking for, and could really use some help. I cannot for the life of me figure out where the code accepts a block being broken. I have tracked the packet from "C07PacketPlayerDigging" to EntityInWorldManager (yes, these are MCP names), but the logic in there is a real mess.
02:36 < Jckf> I've also looked at some old CraftBukkit code to see where they trigger BlockBreakEvent, but it looks like they've rewritten most of that class.
02:37 < Jckf> EntityInWorldManager that is. CraftBukkit calls in PlayerInteractManager
02:37 < Jckf> "mx" in obfuscated form
02:39 <+Amaranth_> Drainedsoul: I notice your Minecraft server isn't public domain either: https://github.com/RobertLeahy/MCPP/blob/master/LICENSE.txt
02:41 <+AndrewPH> Amaranth: I suggest a pull request removing that file. After all, what's the risk? He's already getting credit if somebody strips his name from it.
02:42 < enchilado> No, just replace his name with your own
02:42 <+AndrewPH> both
02:42 < enchilado> I mean, claiming someone else's work as yours is totally cool, right?
02:44 <+AndrewPH> No, that's a red herring. 
02:46 < enchilado> No, that's a misrepresentation.
02:46 <+AndrewPH> I just wrote that, not you.
02:57 < Dhruv0>  
04:52 < Not-fc45> [MCPP] RobertLeahy pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±1] http://git.io/862VOA
04:52 < Not-fc45> [MCPP] RobertLeahy 2b9223a - Update LICENSE.txt - Unlicense
04:52 < dx> HEH
05:06  * dx just caught up with the conversation above, realizes that this "HEH" was slightly inappropriate
05:06 < enchilado> I don't think it was inappropriate
05:06 < enchilado> I think it's hilarious
05:07 < enchilado> Deserved a couple more "EH"s on the end, perhaps
05:08 < dx> ehhh, well, i mean, it wasn't something as trivial as what i thought when i said it
05:21 < dx> also, you guys haven't focused enough on the most important part: calling the parents of an arrogant 14 year old kid who can't code, wants to create a post-bukkit replacement server by stealing code of other people, claiming it as his own, then denying that any of that ever happened... and taking donations for that huge lie.
09:42 < Not-fc45> [fNbt] fragmer pushed 2 commits to master [+1/-1/±5] http://git.io/0z37IQ
09:42 < Not-fc45> [fNbt] fragmer 5e6ad2f - Improved consistency of argument order in the API. Renamed SerializerOptions to ConversionOptions.
09:42 < Not-fc45> [fNbt] fragmer 2f44530 - Continuing work on DynamicConverter
13:26 < yawkat> is any part of the team packet being json-encoded in 1.8?
13:27 < yawkat> I am getting a json decode error when I send them but can't find anything json-related in the doc
13:51 < yawkat> ah, looks like it was display name in ping list packet and not scoreboard
14:38 < SopaXorzTaker> hello?
14:39 < SopaXorzTaker> need help
14:39 <+sadimusi> hi
14:39 < SopaXorzTaker> so, did anyone implement a server in python
14:39 <+sadimusi> there's bravo but it's incomplete and probably quite out of date
14:41 <+sadimusi> at this point there is no complete server in any language…
14:43 < SopaXorzTaker> oh!
14:44 < SopaXorzTaker> who knows minecraft classic protocol then? I try to write my own server, but the game does not understand the chunks
15:02 < Jckf> wiki.vg knows it
17:54 < SopaXorzTaker> Jckf: alreadly did
17:55 < SopaXorzTaker> not even a word about the chunk format
17:57 <+SirCmpwn> the chunk format is pretty simple
17:57 <+SirCmpwn> classic doesn't use chunks in the same sense that modern minecraft does
17:58 <+SirCmpwn> classic has a world of a fixed size and the whole thing is downloaded when you log in
17:58 < SopaXorzTaker> no shoghicp s there yay
17:58 <+SirCmpwn> what?
17:58 < SopaXorzTaker> ah, personal
17:58 < shoghicp> o/
17:58 < SopaXorzTaker> WAT
17:58 < SopaXorzTaker> okay
17:59 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: but what size it uses
17:59 <+SirCmpwn> depends on the server
17:59 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: is it a three dimension array
17:59 <+SirCmpwn> the protocol documents how the size of the world is given to you
17:59 < SopaXorzTaker> gzipped
17:59 <+SirCmpwn> a 3 dimensional array is just magic under the covers
17:59 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: yes I tried
18:00 <+SirCmpwn> magic being x*width*height+y*height+z or something
18:00 < SopaXorzTaker> it just hangs after sending chunks D:
18:00 <+SirCmpwn> this is the only classic code I have handy: https://github.com/SirCmpwn/RetroCraft
18:01 <+SirCmpwn> I wrote a classic server once, a long time ago, I should try to find it
18:01 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: can you just write a gist about chunk format please
18:01 <+SirCmpwn> no, fuck off
18:01 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: i want just to do it
18:02 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: :<
18:02 < shoghicp> so lovely :3
18:02 < SopaXorzTaker> shoghicp: people in #dogecoin use them :>
18:03 < SopaXorzTaker> SirCmpwn: AHA! https://github.com/SirCmpwn/RetroCraft/blob/master/RetroCraft/ChunkHelper.cs
18:03 <+SirCmpwn> this encodes a modern chunk data packet
18:04 <+SirCmpwn> you want this: https://github.com/SirCmpwn/RetroCraft/blob/master/RetroCraft/ClassicHandlers/LevelHandlers.cs
18:07 <+SirCmpwn> SinZ: do you have a copy of that classic server I wrote ages ago?
18:09 < SinZ> which part of the chunk format is this
18:09 < SinZ> in networking or storage
18:10 <+SirCmpwn> ?
18:10 <+SirCmpwn> oh, this file I linked to is on the wire
18:10 <+SirCmpwn> on disk it's a java serialized object
18:10 <+SirCmpwn> fragmer has some code for reading those
18:12 <+SirCmpwn> SinZ: so you don't have a copy of that classic server?
18:12 < SinZ> not the one you made
18:12 <+SirCmpwn> oh well
18:12 <+SirCmpwn> it may be lost forever
18:13 < SopaXorzTaker> meeee meeee meeeee woooooooe
18:16 < SinZ> might want to look into https://github.com/umby24/Hypercube/blob/master/Hypercube_Rewrite/Map/HypercubeMap.cs#L501-L571 though
18:18 <+SirCmpwn> Craft.Net has basic classic support, fwiw, including a full protocol implementation https://github.com/SirCmpwn/Craft.Net/tree/master/source/Classic
18:20 < SinZ> in classic noone really used the vannila format
20:03 <+fragmer> SirCmpwn, looking for Classic-related info? I'd be happy to help
20:03 < jython234[ping]> Heh classic
20:04 <+SirCmpwn> "SopaXorzTaker" is who you want to talk to
20:04 <+SirCmpwn> I directed him to you.
20:04 <+fragmer> Ah ok. Haven't heard from them yet.
23:50 < woder> did they change how chunk coords work with negative values? I get -64.856/16 = -4.05 minecraft client gives me -5, anyone know what its doing?
--- Day changed dim. sept. 21 2014
02:02 <+Amaranth> woder: Remember the negative side starts at -1, chunk 0 is 0-15
02:04 <+Amaranth> Although in this case it appears you are doing -64/16 and the client is doing -65/16 actually
02:04 <+Amaranth> So forget what I said before
02:28 < Not-fc45> [fNbt] fragmer pushed 1 commit to master [+0/-0/±3] http://git.io/uN67sQ
02:28 < Not-fc45> [fNbt] fragmer bcea536 - Implemented serialization of Array and IList properties in DynamicConverter
02:38 < woder> Amaranth: do you have any idea what could do that? :c
02:38 <+Amaranth> The client rounding instead of flooring?
02:39 < woder> would you happy to know what direction it rounds? (down?)
02:39 < woder> *happen
02:41 < Jckf> Does this belong on the wiki somewhere? http://www.jckf.no/minecraft/mcpbrowser/?mc=1.7.10
02:46 < dx> Jckf: is this MCP deobfuscation?
02:46 < dx> ...derp nevermind, says that in the url and title
02:47 < Jckf> ;)
02:47 < dx> the name of the github repo confused me, thought it was like bukkit's mc-dev
02:48 <+md_5> Jckf https://github.com/Jckf/mc-dev    <--- Dont put that on github. MCP will get annoyed
02:48 < dx> yeah not to mention you don't have rights to that code...
02:48 <+md_5> License and terms of use.
02:48 <+md_5> You are NOT allowed to:
02:48 <+md_5> - Release the decompiled source code of Minecraft in any way.
02:48 <+md_5> ^^ from the MCP license
02:49 < Jckf> It's so usefull though =|
02:49 < dx> that's a terrible excuse to break a license :P
02:49 < dx> find some other way
02:50 < Jckf> Displaying it in the web application doesn't count as distribution, does it? You're only talking about the repo?
02:50 < dx> better ask MCP about that
02:51 < Jckf> Will do
02:51 < Jckf> FOr now, forget the link
02:51 < Jckf> ;)
02:51 < dx> oh. the source code is down there...
02:51 < dx> that's definitely not ok
02:51 < Jckf> Yes, it's fetched from GitHub
02:52  * Jckf erases everyone's memories
02:52 < dx> Jckf: how about a version of this thing that is compiled to html files by running a script locally, referencing the locally decompiled mcp source?
02:54 < dx> https://github.com/bukkit/mc-dev/ <--- how does this thing still work
02:55 < Jckf> dx: I'm thinking; make the repo private, clone it on the web server, fetch files locally instead of over HTTP
02:55 < dx> Jckf: in that case you don't even need a repo in github
02:56 < Jckf> As far as you know once it's private, I don't have one ;)
02:56 < dx> Jckf: still, displaying the whole source of each file inside your browser is not ok
02:56 < Jckf> Anyone can download MCP and get the same files though =/
02:56 < dx> yes
02:57 < dx> 21:48 <+md_5> You are NOT allowed to:
02:57 < dx> 21:48 <+md_5> - Release the decompiled source code of Minecraft in any way.
02:57 < dx> just don't release
02:57 <+md_5> all your browser does is show the method / field signatures
02:57 <+md_5> you can do that without the source
02:57 < dx> yeah that's probably acceptable
02:57 < Jckf> Referencing the source is good for figuring out what a method does
02:58 < dx> yes ok that's cool, you just can't do it legally
02:59 < dx> (meanwhile, handwaving mojang's copyright)
03:00 < dx> well, that part of the MCP license is just a superset of the "do not distribute jars" part of the EULA
03:00 <+md_5> make your program standalone or w/e
03:00 <+md_5> putting it on a web page is a bad idea though
03:00 < dx> yep
03:02 < dx> EULA says "let other people get access to anything we‘ve made in a way that is unfair or unreasonable". yes that's pretty high quality legal text that is totally not vague
03:02 <+md_5> this isnt about Mojang at all
03:02 <+md_5> this is about MCP
03:02 < dx> yeah i know
03:03 < Jckf> Repo made private, and source code view disabled.
03:03 < Jckf> Awaiting reply from #mcp
03:05 < Jckf> I could display the decompiled code though. That's made with Fernflower alone
03:05 < dx> no
03:05 < Jckf> Just not the deobfuscated code
03:05 <+md_5> yes
03:05 < dx> md_5: but mojang...
03:06 < Jckf> Mojang made a statement on Bukkit.org that decompiled code is not their property, iirc
03:06 < Jckf> (which was weird)
03:06 <+md_5> meh mojang hasnt gotten pissy at anyone in the past
03:06 <+md_5> MCP on the other hand has
03:06 < dx> heh
03:06 < dx> Jckf: that makes sense, it's how they say the DMCA is invalid
03:07 < Jckf> From a "we want to stop the madness" perspective, yes
03:07 < Jckf> But everyone knows it's their property =P
03:08 < dx> you could argue the decompiler creates something entirely new
03:08 < dx> but meh
03:08 < Jckf> "It's not decompiling.. It's automatic reverse engineering"
03:08 < Jckf> Hue hue
03:08 < dx> hahah
03:10 < dx> when i grow up i want to be a lawyer, so i can go back in my irc logs and see how much bullshit i've said
03:11 < Jckf> Looking back at who you used to be and realizing you were an idiot is usually just painfull =P
03:11 < Jckf> We've all been there though
03:12 < Jckf> Hopefully
03:13 < Jckf> I like to think that people are intelligent and self-reflected
04:40 < Aaron1011> The 'color' field in the Teams packet seems to be redundant
04:40 < Aaron1011> Isn't that the same thing as prefix?
04:40 < Aaron1011> http://wiki.vg/Protocol#Update_Score
15:30 < UltimateBudgie> Ok, so after encryption, all the packet is encrypted including the length right? Is the length value the length of the unencrypted or encrypted packet data?
15:31 < shoghicp> all the stream is encrypted
15:31 < shoghicp> also, the length would be the same, encryption is the last step
15:34 < UltimateBudgie> Ok awesome! :D
15:34 < UltimateBudgie> That's what I think I'm doing
15:50 < SopaXorzTaker> MrARM: hey autograph bro
15:50 < SopaXorzTaker> shoghicp: HIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIii
15:50 < SopaXorzTaker> lol
15:50 < SopaXorzTaker> :D
15:51 < shoghicp> please do not ping me for those things
15:51 < SinZ> that is an easy way to just be kicked/banned from here
15:52 < shoghicp> that's exactly why that happened elsewhere ;)
16:26 < shoghicp> I'm having an absurd amount of lag when I spawn the client in 1.8
16:26 < shoghicp> I send a flat world
16:27 < shoghicp> but the client can't handle more than 8-10, and blocks completely
16:27 < Thinkofdeath> Did you compress the packets?
16:27 < shoghicp> Yes, tested compressing and not compressing
16:27 < shoghicp> well, they *should*
16:28 < shoghicp> let me check if the value is getting to that thread right
16:44 < shoghicp> well... something is wrong here
16:54 < shoghicp> there was a packet confusion, the client-side packet was sent instead of the server-side one
16:55 < shoghicp> (for player movement)
17:31 < woder> for the chunk data, the block section is a unsigned short array of the length of the number of blocks in the chunkÉ
17:31 < woder> ?
20:44 < gurun> Evening guys. I'm looking for a server written in C#. Any pointers?
20:54 < cindy_k> there's a project that people have been working on
20:55 < cindy_k> https://github.com/SirCmpwn/Craft.Net
20:55  * SirCmpwn peeks in
20:57 < cindy_k> <generic geek joke about the fact there isn't  really pointers in C#> here
20:57 <+SirCmpwn> C# does have pointers
20:58 <+SirCmpwn> also https://xkcd.com/138/
20:58 < cindy_k> O.o delegates
20:58 < cindy_k> I like my *'s
20:58 <+SirCmpwn> no, C# has actual pointers with * and & and such
20:59 <+SirCmpwn> example: https://github.com/SirCmpwn/Craft.Net/blob/master/source/Craft.Net.Anvil/Level.cs#L170-L171
20:59 <+SirCmpwn> also: https://github.com/SirCmpwn/Craft.Net/blob/master/source/Craft.Net.Common/MathHelper.cs#L164
21:02 < gurun> Yep found Craft.Net. But i should have been a bit more specific.. I'm looking for PE servers.
21:02 <+SirCmpwn> yes, you definitely should have been more specific
21:03 < gurun> Noticed that it seems to be built on RakNet.
21:03 <+SirCmpwn> Craft.Net will accept a pull request with PE support (already has Classic support)
21:03 <+SirCmpwn> but I don't know of any existing C# implementations
21:03 < cindy_k> SirCmpwn  :) caught by not keeping up with C# additions. I started C# with 2003 and they didn't have them available then
21:03 < cindy_k> but 2003 was bad, they were missing a lot of stuff
21:04 <+SirCmpwn> cindy_k: C# has had pointers for a very long time
21:04 < gurun> Yeah, sorry. Didn't know that it was different protocols. Just realized that when I scrolled further down the page. Never got that far. To eager to get started. Though I'd have something to do during the weekend, and build a server for my kid.
21:04 < shoghicp> gurun: I don't think there are C# implementation
21:04 < shoghicp> s*
21:04 < shoghicp> There is PocketMine in PHP, then BlockServer in Java
21:04 <+SirCmpwn> gurun: that's probably not a weekend project
21:05  * cindy_k has been stuck in the land for 1996 compilers for a long time. 
21:05 < shoghicp> BlockServer ports most of the protocol things from PocketMine, though ;)
21:05 < cindy_k> I have free'd myself! I will never have to open visual studio 6 again
21:05 <+SirCmpwn> cindy_k: pointers were present in C# 1.0, 1999
21:05  * SirCmpwn just double checked
21:06 < gurun> yeah, pointers are a great way to work in an unsafe context. In the literal sense of the word :-)
21:06 < shoghicp> gurun: If you start the project and have protocol questions, ask me
21:06 <+SirCmpwn> the last person born before C# had pointers is now a sophomore in high school
21:08 < gurun> shoghicp, thanks. I'll get started right away. I'll check out PocketMine and BlockServer. Thinking that I can rip some packet definitions from them to get started fast.
21:09 < shoghicp> I'm the PocketMine-MP maintainer ;)
21:09 < gurun> oh, great.
21:10 < gurun> i SierCmpwn is also here, so maybe I can contribute a PE stack to Craft.Net if needed.
21:11 <+SirCmpwn> "SierCmpwn" is a new one
21:14 < gurun> ouch. Now I see .. It's not just protocol hacking .. you have to build the whole world shit too. Eh.
21:14 <+SirCmpwn> which is why Craft.Net is probably a good starting point
21:14 <+SirCmpwn> a lot of the non-protocol infrastructure is in place, too
21:16 <+AndrewPH> sirecampaign
21:18 < gurun> yeah, so I could clone the server from that, use all the physics and all, and then focus on implementing the protocol. Is the maps and all same between PE and the .. real MC?
21:22 <+SirCmpwn> no clue, I haven't done anything with PE
21:24 < gurun> Just reading about it. It is different.
21:24 < shoghicp> gurun: yeah, different
21:24 < shoghicp> TCP vs UDP + RakNet
21:24 < shoghicp> protocol is different
21:24 < shoghicp> different world format and block order
21:24 < shoghicp> little endian NBT instead of big endian
21:28 < Aragas> yep. Like more new kool code
21:28 <+SirCmpwn> that's not to say that a lot of code reuse is possible
21:28 < gurun> So in your code i notice you have an importer. What is it importing FROM ?
21:28 < Aragas> and why not use main protocol?
21:28 < Aragas> so lame
21:28 <+SirCmpwn> fragmer: does fnbt support little endian nbt?
21:29 < shoghicp> most of the things can be reused with minor modifications
21:29 < gurun> i can be pretty sure that they choose to store in BE to make sure that it is read/write in network order. To avoid translation.
21:30 < shoghicp> that's PC
21:30 < shoghicp> PE does it in LE
21:30 < shoghicp> or BE
21:30 < shoghicp> or a mix!
21:30 < shoghicp> \o/ Minecraft \o/
21:30 < gurun> even better. But by principle going over network should be BE.
21:31 < gurun> mix is the worst.
21:31 < gurun> maybe they wrote it TDD but without the part about refactoring :-P
21:31 <+fragmer> SirCmpwn: yes it does
21:33 <+fragmer> Endianness can be set per-file (yourFile.BigEndian = true/false) or a default can be set per-AppDomain (NbtFile.BigEndianByDefault = true/false)
21:33 <+fragmer> BigEndianByDefault itself defaults to 'true'
21:33 < gurun> Ok, so PocketMine has a bit of a pluggable design for loading worlds. Nice.
21:33 < shoghicp> Anvil + McRegion :)
21:33 < shoghicp> McRegion preferred, since it is the same block order
21:34 < shoghicp> sending them to the client is faster
21:41 < gurun> i can't find any unit-tests for PocketMine.. was hoping for some sample data for worlds and stuff. Is it not in there.. or you don't do that stuff :-)
21:41 <+SirCmpwn> well, it is written in PHP
21:42 < shoghicp> gurun: we had to remove everything we had
21:42 < shoghicp> got Travis-CI working again a few days ago
21:45 < gurun> so, if you go  back in history i'll find stuff right?
21:46 < shoghicp> only basic stuff with binary read/write and really bad things
21:46 < shoghicp> you've to go really far in the history
21:46 < shoghicp> before the current version was written
21:46 < gurun> ok. i was looking more for sample maps and stuff like. So i have something to .. send.
21:47 < gurun> but i guess i can google that too. should be out there.
21:47 < shoghicp> McRegion / Anvil worlds are the Minecraft ones :)
21:49 < gurun> My son went online gaming today .. it's crappy because we don't have any servers in sweden it seems. But i did notice that they had some seriously custom shit going on these servers. But is it safe to assume that PE maps and stuff aren't as capable as the real MC?
21:49 <+AndrewPH> Now that's what I call a scientific evaluation
21:50 < shoghicp> well, the 0.9 update added interesting things
21:50 < shoghicp> like infinite worlds, yay
21:50 < shoghicp> but you don't have redstone things
21:50 < shoghicp> nor nether
21:50 < shoghicp> nor all the PC movs
21:50 < shoghicp> they want to add all of that
21:51 < shoghicp> modding is not complex as it is on MC: PC
21:51 < shoghicp> and it's done in Javascript...
21:51 < shoghicp> servers can do more, there are awesome plugins
21:51 < shoghicp> and minigame servers, of course
21:51 < gurun> basically .... i just want to import some larger OTS worlds for my son to practice his TNT skills on. I'll be his hero for ever :-)
21:52 < shoghicp> ots?
21:52 < gurun> off-the-shelf
21:52 < gurun> ready made
21:52 < shoghicp> oh!
21:53 < shoghicp> also, keep an eye on PC-only blocks
21:53 < gurun> but i realized that it could be fun .. to actually code the server for it.
21:53 < shoghicp> as they'll crash the MCPE client
21:53 < gurun> PC only blocks .. ok. 
21:53 < gurun> i wonder..
21:53 < shoghicp> oh, you reminded me that I have to port TNT explosions from the old version
21:54 < gurun> when they run this on the PE clients.. do they use the exact same stuff as on the server, just running hosted on the device?
21:54 < shoghicp> williamtdr: do you have the block crash list?
21:54 < shoghicp> gurun: no, they use the embedded server
21:54 < shoghicp> but you can also run PocketMine on Android
21:54 < shoghicp> there is an app on the Play Store, free
21:55 < gurun> ok. so they have different implementations for the server and .. clients.
21:55 < shoghicp> it's in Minecraft: PE itself
21:55 < shoghicp> when you play on single player, it runs the server in the background
21:56 < gurun> yeah, but embedded or not. It has to share 80% of the stuff. Never mind .. who can know :-)
21:56 < gurun> I'm thinking ..
21:57 < gurun> Looking at your code. I don't know PHP that well. Just coded extensions for Kayako (trouble ticketing). And I was so scared off by the code I thought I would never touch that stuff again.
21:58 < gurun> But .. that PHP code actually looks a lot like structured programming. I have storm installed already. Maybe I should just go with that.
21:58 < shoghicp> well, this is different than some PHP around there that makes me cringe
21:58 < gurun> yeah, it looks like .. code.
21:59 < shoghicp> you even have multithreading here, heh
21:59 < gurun> haha
21:59 < gurun> i get the same sensation as when i discovered that NodeJS wasn't another ugly plugin to jQuery. Felt like an idiot. 
22:02 < shoghicp> well, I'll leave you looking around
22:03 < shoghicp> ping me if you have questions, I'll reply later
22:08 < gurun> yep, thanks
22:37 < Grobat> Hey i'm trying to write my own server and i have trouble to spawn other player entitys. I'm sending an Spawn Player (0x0C) packet but nothing happens and i'm pretty sure that my packet is valid. any idea? (mc: 1.8)
23:01 < gurun> shoghicp: FULL_CHUNK_DATA_PACKET .. isn't part of the wiki. Is that for sending .. a chunk of a world?
23:02 < shoghicp> gurun: The wiki was generated automatically using PocketBurger, and it's a bit broken on 0.9
23:03 < shoghicp> its structure:
23:04 < shoghicp> two le 32-bit int, chunkX and chunkZ
23:04 < shoghicp> 16x128x16 blockIds (byte)
23:04 < shoghicp> 16x128x16 blockData (half byte)
23:04 < shoghicp> 16x128x16 blockLight (half byte)
23:04 < shoghicp> 16x128x16 skyLight (half byte)
23:05 < shoghicp> then, NBT data of tile entities than need extra data to spawn, if any
23:05 < shoghicp> like signs or chests
23:05 < shoghicp> all of that is compressed using DEFLATE
23:05 < shoghicp> and yeah, chunkX and chunkZ is inside the compressed data
23:06 < shoghicp> block order is like on McRegion
23:08 < shoghicp> oh, I forgot
23:08 < shoghicp> before the NBT, after skyLight
23:08 < shoghicp> 256 bytes of biomeId
23:09 < shoghicp> and 256 int of grassColor (?RGB)
23:09 < shoghicp> gurun: https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/level/format/mcregion/McRegion.php#L110-L141
23:12 < gurun> shoghicp: Ok. Understand. So the protocol you have implemented only seems to use that package for actual data upload. Is that correct? All the other chunk messages seems to have .. dissapeared on the way.
23:12 < shoghicp> yep, no ChunkDataPacket nor ChunkUnloadpPacket
23:12 < shoghicp> it's still in the code, but Johan (@jbenrhardsson on Twitter) confirmed that it does nothing in the code
23:13 < gurun> Oh, great.
23:13 < shoghicp> nothing useful, it can cause crashes if sent
23:13 < shoghicp> clients spawn when 56 chunks are received
23:13 < gurun> So. Another quick question (got the chunking now. Know where to look).
23:13 < shoghicp> and maintain a list of 96 chunks, at least
23:13 < shoghicp> they can handle more, but they can unload them without telling the server
23:13 < gurun> The first real thing after "handshake/etc" seems to be "Start game". It contains a seed.
23:14 < gurun> what is the seed actually used for?
23:14 < shoghicp> client does nothing with it
23:14 < shoghicp> it used to generate the world
23:14 < shoghicp> then the server sent a diff of the changes
23:14 < shoghicp> you can send whatever you want there :)
23:15 < shoghicp> hmm, I'll tell him to remove that since it's no longer used
23:15 <+Amaranth> 56 and 96? Where do those numbers come from?
23:15 < gurun> ok. too bad. I was kind of hoping that it would be a quick way to let the client take care of the world-generate and be up and running fast.
23:15 <+Amaranth> The PC version does your chunk and a radius out from it
23:15 < gurun> 56 & 96.
23:15 < shoghicp> Amaranth: lots of testing, then talking with the devs
23:15 < shoghicp> MCPE uses circular chunk sending
23:15 < gurun> It is the current going rate in yen for the Mojang stock?
23:16 <+Amaranth> Ok, circles make sense
23:16 < shoghicp> https://botbot.me/freenode/mcpedevs/2014-08-12/?msg=19576599&page=2
23:16 < gurun> Ok, so a developer running around in circles appear to me .. as lack of QA resources.
23:16 <+Amaranth> I wish the PC did circles too although it makes some of the logic more complicated it would save a lot of bandwidth and GPU time
23:16 < shoghicp> logs from when that was said :)
23:19 < shoghicp> Amaranth: well, at least they ported the optimizations they did on MCPE to PC
23:19 <+Amaranth> One of them
23:19 <+Amaranth> And I'm not so sure it was even the same algorithm just the same high level idea
23:20 < shoghicp> tommo did a blog post about that a few weeks ago
23:20 < gurun> yeah, thanks for the log. Interesting reading .. especially the part about saying something like "we are about to throw all the old shit out the window and start from scratch. It is really cool". Not so cool if you implement it using sniffers :-)
23:21 <+Amaranth> shoghicp: I'm aware
23:21 < shoghicp> ok :)
23:21 <+Amaranth> I discussed it with him on reddit trying to get details and tell him my idea to see if they were the same
23:21 < gurun> they seem cool about people hacking the protocol though,. Can't say the same for when we hacked ICQ.
23:21 < shoghicp> gurun: I'm expecting it. I can't have all the inventory on the server side without it it glitching the hotbar
23:21 <+Amaranth> He explained it then and then wrote a blog post to explain it in more detail
23:22 < shoghicp> gurun: haha, I reported them several type errors
23:22 < shoghicp> or weird behavior like the client turning to a server
23:22 < shoghicp> and sending server-only packets
23:22 <+Amaranth> Hmm, my rustc appears to be stuck in an infinite loop or something
23:23 < gurun> so. The tool you had for stealing the info .. PocketBurger. It doesn't sound like a sniffer. Sounds like it is reading .. files from the client or something. Is that correct or just an illusion. I don't know Android really.
23:24 < shoghicp> it reads ARM assembly dumps
23:24 < shoghicp> from a .so library
23:24 < gurun> oh. so decompiler basically
23:24 < shoghicp> nope, it needs it decompiled :)
23:24 < shoghicp> and it's all hacky code
23:24 < shoghicp> it helps updating things fast
23:25 < shoghicp> but won't tell you field names
23:25 < shoghicp> or complex packets
23:25 < shoghicp> and on 0.9, all the info about int/float was removed
23:25 < shoghicp> now they write bits directly
23:25 < shoghicp> there is a Wireshark filter, but it's a bit buggy
23:26 < shoghicp> then there is a plugin for PocketMine-MP that logs the PE protocol, useful to research weird things and client crashes
23:26 < gurun> isn't applications on android written in java?
23:26 < shoghicp> only the wrapper is written in Java
23:26 < shoghicp> MCPE for Android and iOS share most of the codebase
23:27 < gurun> oh, so you can have native stuff on android. sorry for my ignorance. would imagine that was the last thing i'd see.
23:27 < gurun> just thinking .. that
23:27 < gurun> getting the app in java and reverse engineer that (illegal for sure) would be easier.
23:28 < gurun> but then it doesn't really exist.
23:28 < gurun> So, where does all the naming and stuff come from. Your head or?
23:28 < shoghicp> well, they are OK with me using PocketBurger and looking at the assembly, if it is for getting the protocol info
23:29 < shoghicp> nope, calls on assembly
23:29 < shoghicp> Android has some debug info
23:29 < shoghicp> it contains things like FullChunkDataPacket::read()
23:29 < shoghicp> FullChunkDataPacket::write()
23:30 < gurun> oh, ok. makes sense then. but no named structures that you can extract i guess?
23:30 < shoghicp> only other calls and bit length
23:30 < shoghicp> http://p.wiki.vg/0.8.0.html#packets
23:30 < shoghicp> that is from 0.8.0
23:31 < shoghicp> but most of those fields are just writeBytes() calls now
23:31 < shoghicp> so you don't know if it is an int/float, you've to guess
23:31 < shoghicp> at least it's similar to the old PC protocol
23:31 < shoghicp> before all the varInt stuff
23:32 < gurun> does it work with 09 alpha?
23:32 < gurun> i mean the server
23:32 < shoghicp> pocketmine?
23:32 < gurun> yes
23:32 < shoghicp> yeah, 1.4
23:32 < shoghicp> get the beta build
23:32 < shoghicp> or the development build
23:32 < gurun> ok, good.
23:32 < shoghicp> there are some rough things, since most of the code has been rewritten
23:33 < gurun> do you auto-generate the code for the packages or .. write them by hand. thinking that the burger tool .. could be joined by some cheese to generate an XML file or similar.
23:33 < gurun> .. so i can steal that and just generate my stuff :-)¨
23:33 < shoghicp> I do it by hand, there are a lot of things wrong
23:34 < gurun> maybe we should join force on that anyway. Document the protocol in like a structured format. With names and stuff... and then it can be used to generate the stuff needed. Like the wiki-page.'
23:34 < gurun> so edit the XML to update instead of hand enditing wiki and classes.
23:35 < shoghicp> yeah, PocketBurger did that, it had a markdown generator
23:35 < gurun> and java, php, whatever can do that.
23:35 < shoghicp> it produces json
23:35 < shoghicp> and it's compatible with Hamburglar and BurgerVitrine
23:35 < gurun> yeah, but the automatic output you have, is still not with names for the fields and stuff.
23:35 < gurun> that needs to be added, right?
23:35 < gurun> by hand
23:35 < shoghicp> you can't do that directly :)
23:35 < shoghicp> there is no info for that
23:36 < gurun> yeah, so that is what i mean. 
23:36 < gurun> use burger to get the stuff out, and then handedit XML. And from that generate both specs and code.
23:36 < shoghicp> I can get better things from the PM code now ;)
23:37 < gurun> I once wrote an X3D player (VR plugin for browsers). I took the spec and applied regexp to it .. and it generated the whole codebase. It would have taken me weeks otherwise.
23:37 < shoghicp> the packet class structure is straightforward
23:37 < shoghicp> field declaration
23:37 < shoghicp> then encode()
23:37 < shoghicp> and decode()
23:38 < gurun> yeah, you had a simple pattern. nothing cryptic about it.
23:38 < gurun> the only thing i would have changed in your source .. is perhaps making sure that the classes could identify themselves.
23:38 < gurun> (the id i mean)
23:38 < shoghicp> hmm, what do you mean?
23:39 < shoghicp> oh, id number?
23:39 < shoghicp> https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/network/protocol/Info.php
23:39 < gurun> get rid of the switch in https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/network/RakLibInterface.php
23:40 < shoghicp> /TODO: more efficient selection based on range
23:40 < gurun> yes i saw the info.php. That is why i started asking about the chunk-data.
23:40 < shoghicp> I had something like that before
23:40 < shoghicp> a parser that created the class
23:40 < shoghicp> but it was slower than this
23:41 < gurun> the good thing about info.php is that .. well, it was easy to get an overview of the protocol :-)
23:41 < gurun> one thing i learned in java.. was to ALWAYS reuse package containers. as much as possible.
23:42 < shoghicp> https://github.com/nikic/PHP-Parser/
23:42 < shoghicp> if you want to do it using an AST instead of regular expressions :)
23:43 < gurun> nah
23:43 < gurun> it's not like that .. 
23:44 < gurun> :-)
23:44 < shoghicp> https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/network/protocol/RotateHeadPacket.php
23:44 < shoghicp> those packets will be tricky to parse :)
23:44 < shoghicp> most movement/rotation packets are sent as a list of entities
23:45 < shoghicp> instead of multiple packets
23:45 < gurun> 		$this->reset();
23:45 < gurun> is that .. reseting the buffer .. for reuse?
23:45 < shoghicp> had several calls for that because of old packets, I guess I can remove that now
23:45 < shoghicp> plugins can modify and mess up packets
23:46 < shoghicp> oh, and before, queues were in the same thread
23:46 < shoghicp> now all the RakNet stuff is on a different thread and library, RakLib
23:46 < gurun> so, for packages with dynamic length like that, it's difficult to be effecient.
23:47 < shoghicp> you can just detect that and write some pseudocode
23:47 < shoghicp> like old Burger did
23:47 < gurun> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa365198(v=vs.85).aspx
23:48 < gurun> that is a saver for threading on windows. Do you know if PHP is capable of using that?
23:48 < shoghicp> I use http://pthreads.org/ on PHP
23:48 < shoghicp> they fixed most of the bugs I reported, so it's really nice now :)
23:49 < shoghicp> also, this has to run on Windows, Linux, MacOS, Android and iOS
23:49 < gurun> Java didn't have that before they released the new IO packages that used select.
23:50 < gurun> yeah, but performance is always hurt. Remembers doing this in Perl early on with p/green threads and all (too old to remember details). And then we learned how to use select and stuff.. and then you could code again.,
23:51 < gurun> Doing highperformance multi-users scenarios for Java was never really practical before that.
23:51 < shoghicp> THis pthreads extension had a Windows memory leak of about 30MB/s
23:51 < gurun> haha
23:51 < gurun> fantastic :-)
23:51 < shoghicp> it's fixed now, Windows stuff :)
23:51 < shoghicp> so now I can use the OOP way, instead of IPC sockets!
23:52 < gurun> well, php looks easy enough to work with.
23:52 < gurun> if you have a good editor that is.
23:53 < shoghicp> PhpStorm <3
23:53 < shoghicp> We have an open-source license for the project :)
23:53 < gurun> shit, don't know where any of us would be without jetbrains these days. I would for sure not work with Visual Studio.. can't handle it without resharper.
23:54 < gurun> i use their java and php editors in express edition. Has everything i want anyway since i don't do a lot of GUI shit these days.
23:54 < shoghicp> I did most of the things using a plain editor with syntax coloring :)
23:54 < shoghicp> then when I had to rewrite things, I started using an IDE
23:55 < shoghicp> well, I like the idea of generating autodocs from the code
23:56 < gurun> hehe ..
23:56 < gurun> well .. now i understand what you mean.
23:56 < shoghicp> I'll try to maintain the structure the same >:)
23:56 < gurun> let the code speak.
23:57 < gurun> maybe i should use that parser then .. and parse your code.. and generate C# from that.
23:57 < gurun> now it makes perfect sense.
23:58 < shoghicp> PlaceBlockPacket is not used in MCPE, but it's on the code
23:58 < gurun> i was kind of hoping that i could steal it from the Java code.. but they seem to have not gotn very far..
23:58 < shoghicp> SetEntityLinkPacket is not implemented, yet
23:58 < shoghicp> and another one
23:58 < shoghicp> gurun: they ported RakLib (RakNet protocol in PHP) to Java
23:59 < gurun> yeah, but that is like .. an hours work, isn't it?
23:59 < shoghicp> then used pocketmine structure of minecraft packets
23:59 < shoghicp> it's easy to port OOP PHP code to Java
--- Day changed lun. sept. 22 2014
00:00 < shoghicp> compare https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/network/protocol/LoginPacket.php with https://github.com/PocketMine/PocketMine-MP/blob/master/src/pocketmine/network/protocol/LoginPacket.php
00:00 < shoghicp> and https://github.com/BlockServerProject/BlockServer/blob/master/src/java/org/blockserver/network/raknet/AcknowledgePacket.java with https://github.com/PocketMine/RakLib/blob/master/protocol/AcknowledgePacket.php
00:03 < shoghicp> well, I've to go :)
00:03 < shoghicp> good luck with the parser
00:11 < gurun> shoghicp: yes .. night. And thanks for the help.
00:12 < gurun> shoghicp: You will find the code here..  https://github.com/NiclasOlofsson/MiNET
14:32 < Aragas> I have something strange. So. i'm tryin' to implement compression. Can be PacketLength=0 and dataLength=1? lol
16:05 < Aragas> This isn't even funny. Last packet that i read correct is LoginSuccess
16:05 < shoghicp> encryption?
16:05 < Aragas> disabled
16:06 < Aragas> only compression
16:06 < shoghicp> hmm, weird
16:07 < Aragas> i always have only weird problems
16:07 < shoghicp> raw packet dump?
16:07 < Aragas> But this is a new record
16:08 < Aragas> Nope. The probles is, i cant read these packets. I get PacketLength=0 and DataLength=1
16:08 < shoghicp> o.O
16:08 < shoghicp> so, first field 0, second 1?
16:08 < Aragas> Yep. Lol
16:09 < Aragas> I read them as varInts, so all is correct
16:09 < shoghicp> :s
16:10 < shoghicp> I've class now, if you get dumps I'll be interested :)
16:11 < Aragas> Wanna the read methode? I wanna upload it on gitHub only when i'm done with this shiet
16:16 < shoghicp> Yeah, create a gist or something
16:16 < shoghicp> I'll get back to you in an hour or so, turning on powersave mode :)
16:18 < Aragas> http://pastebin.com/7MNy17sJ
16:22 < shoghicp> "Pastebin.com is under heavy load right now :("
16:23 < Aragas> okay, gist then
16:23 < Aragas> https://gist.github.com/Aragas/448f954e4e1941176130
16:24 < shoghicp> OnDataReceived(id, _stream.ReadPacket(length - 1, 0));
16:24 < shoghicp> id length can be more than 1 :)
16:24 < shoghicp> (not right now, but it's a varInt)
16:25 < Aragas> Yep
16:25 < Aragas> This is more a debug code
16:25 < shoghicp> that part seems ok
16:26 < shoghicp> need a packet dump D:
16:26 < Aragas> I tried to jut copy glowstone logic, but nope
16:27 < Aragas> Yep. But donno what to use. Anything can dump 1.8 packets yet>?
16:28 < shoghicp> Aragas: client itself? wireshark? tcpdump?
16:29 < shoghicp> you are not using encryption :)
16:29 < Aragas> ah, yes, wireshark
16:43 < Aragas> okay, i think i cant capture my local server
17:05 < Aragas> shoghicp: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58476180/Dump.pcapng
17:05 < Aragas> This?
17:05 < shoghicp> could work :)
17:06 < shoghicp> I can't open it right now
17:06 < shoghicp> will do it in 20 minutes
17:06 < Aragas> Okay
17:25 < shoghicp> Are you the server or client?
17:25 < Aragas> both
17:25 < Aragas> but i'm debuggin' a client
17:28 < shoghicp> Aragas: what is the compression threshold? 256, the default?
17:28 < shoghicp> I think you are sending the set compression packet using the compressed format
17:28 < shoghicp> instead of using the normal packet format
17:30 < Aragas> 256
17:30 < Aragas> wait, i'm the client
17:30 < Aragas> i don't send setCompression, correct?
17:31 < shoghicp> I don't think so
17:31 < shoghicp> wait
17:31 < shoghicp> server is right
17:31 < shoghicp> skipped the packet id :)
17:31 < Aragas> ?
17:32 < shoghicp> you couldn't get past... which packet?
17:32 < Aragas> loginSuccess
17:34 < shoghicp> Aragas: you are one byte after the start of the next packet
17:34 < shoghicp> maybe you read too many bytes?
17:34 < Aragas> hm
17:34 < Aragas> ill check that
17:36 < Aragas> lol, it worked